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Thread: Upgrade path to Radio RA2

  1. #1

    Upgrade path to Radio RA2

    As both utilize Clear Connect, would upgrading to a full Radio RA2 system be a matter of adding the devices to the Master repeater?

    Would there be upgrade incentives to ease the migration to Radio RA2?

  2. #2
    Authorized Lutron Contributor
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    What system are you looking at upgrading to the RadioRA2 system?

  3. #3
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    My apologies for the confusion, but there is not an upgrade path from the Caseta system to the RadioRA2 system.
    Last edited by Brian S.; 02-25-2015 at 03:18 PM. Reason: Fixed typos

  4. #4
    Since there are multiple wireless product lines (Maestro, Caseta, RadioRA2), it would great if there were a clear path for people to upgrade or build up a home automation system over time without having to replace components.

    Right now, the biggest hurdle to home automation is the cost of a fully functional and reliable system.

    Then, there is the issue of multiple protocols, services and systems - security cams, sensors, locks, ...

    Caseta and a simple hub such as Staples Connect provide a fairly "low cost" introduction to home automation that a savvy DIYer can cobble together.
    Lutron's marketing message is that Clear Connect is the means of communication over RF by Lutron.
    It is conceivable that someone who started off with a small HA system would be confused (and disappointed) why the Caseta would be incompatible with a full RadioRA2 implementation.

    There would be a clear advantage over competing RF technologies if products (from one company) built to utilize a standard interoperate seamlessly. Just as 80211 compliant chips from various vendors are able to communicate.

    The currently unfulfilled promise of Zigbee is that products built according to that IEEE standard should interoperate seamlessly.

  5. #5
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    Since there are multiple wireless product lines (Maestro, Caseta, RadioRA2), it would great if there were a clear path for people to upgrade or build up a home automation system over time without having to replace components.
    - I would recommend NOT trying to change LUTRON on this issue. The upgrade path is set by YOU the installer. If your customer is looking for a single room solution, Caseta is the way to go... going past a room or two, you're pricing yourself out of an opportunity to upgrade your customer.

    Right now, the biggest hurdle to home automation is the cost of a fully functional and reliable system.
    - I'm not sure why you consider this a hurdle? You are creating an "oxy-moron" by associating a "fully functional and reliable system" with low cost. IMHO something has to give.

    Then, there is the issue of multiple protocols, services and systems - security cams, sensors, locks, ...
    - Integration is by definition taking individual components and systems and seemlessly combining them into one.

    Caseta and a simple hub such as Staples Connect provide a fairly "low cost" introduction to home automation that a savvy DIYer can cobble together.
    Lutron's marketing message is that Clear Connect is the means of communication over RF by Lutron.
    It is conceivable that someone who started off with a small HA system would be confused (and disappointed) why the Caseta would be incompatible with a full RadioRA2 implementation.
    - if you go back to properly "selling" the system to the owner and setting expectations of the system, you will find that confusion and disappointment is irrelevant and the increased cost to upgrade will no longer be an issue.

    There would be a clear advantage over competing RF technologies if products (from one company) built to utilize a standard interoperate seamlessly. Just as 80211 compliant chips from various vendors are able to communicate.
    - We aren't talking about 50 light switch manufacturers "standardizing" on the Watts / Amps through a 15AMP single pole switch. There are millions of electronic component manufacturers from hundreds of different countries that manufacture devices with different features. The different alliances that form to "standardize" their wireless comunication aren't adding to the benefit of "seamless interoperability". LUTRON did their own Wireless frequency homework. I recommend you read Rich Black's White Paper on RF / Clear Connect technology and see if this doesn't change your mind ---> http://www.lutron.com/TechnicalDocum...whitepaper.pdf

    The currently unfulfilled promise of Zigbee is that products built according to that IEEE standard should interoperate seamlessly.
    ​- see previous.

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  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by troltgen View Post
    Since there are multiple wireless product lines (Maestro, Caseta, RadioRA2), it would great if there were a clear path for people to upgrade or build up a home automation system over time without having to replace components.
    - I would recommend NOT trying to change LUTRON on this issue. The upgrade path is set by YOU the installer. If your customer is looking for a single room solution, Caseta is the way to go... going past a room or two, you're pricing yourself out of an opportunity to upgrade your customer.
    There are going to be situations where the customer has started a DIY install with retail consumer products and then decided they want more, only to be told they have to start from scratch. When the technical reality is the RA2 system could easily support Caseta and Maestro RF products. Very discouraging and likely to lead them to look for alternatives. But good news, you can keep your Picos!

  8. #7
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    Retail vs. custom install

    Quote Originally Posted by az1324 View Post
    There are going to be situations where the customer has started a DIY install with retail consumer products and then decided they want more, only to be told they have to start from scratch. When the technical reality is the RA2 system could easily support Caseta and Maestro RF products. Very discouraging and likely to lead them to look for alternatives. But good news, you can keep your Picos!
    I agree that Casèta certainly CAN be supported by RA2 or even HWQS. The problem then becomes the hundreds of LUTRON dealers that invest and commit to stocking and supporting higher cost systems having to support a system purchased by a retailer with minimal understanding of the product.

    I don't think a product like Casèta (minimal scene control, limited loads) should be any more than it is if only to protect the dealers and installers of Lutron's higher end products like RA2 and HWQS (conditional logic, I/O, limitless loads). Casèta is a great "entry-level" introductory control product that gets homeowners and DIY'ers thinking about lighting control.

  9. #8
    The first point is technology is constantly changing, meaning that existing businesses are disrupted and/ or product lines become obsolete.

    There are ample examples where products from different vendors interoperate using established standards - Wifi, BlueTooth, USB, ..., just not Home Automation just yet.
    Taking Wifi as an example, it is possible to deploy a wireless network without requiring licensed professional(s) to draw up plans, specify every single piece of equipment, ... One consequence is that the need to run ethernet cabling throughout the home has been drastically slashed.

    The consumer will be increasingly enabled/ empowered (i.e. - IFTTT, HomeKit, ...) to deploy home automation (in a manner similar to the proliferation of Wifi) without involving the middleman installer/ dealer.

    The other point I was attempting to make was that all products under the Clear Connect technology should just work seamlessly, which would be a distinct advantage to Lutron. Not necessarily for dealers though.

  10. #9
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    My prediction...homekit will render radiora etc obsolete to all but the smallest market. As homekit matures it will become easy to program and very tightly knitted into the iOS devices. Developers will make tons of homekit apps that do will be able to accomplish all sorts of home automation apps. Next google will create a competing framework for their devices.

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