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Thread: Apple Home Kit - Potential Answer to Home Automation Integration

  1. #21
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    I don't think I'm missing the point at all. I'm well aware of Casseta's increased functionality, and for what I paid for an RA2 setup, I definitely think we should be getting a lot of that functionality - and never suggested otherwise.

    However, mark2457 came in complaining that his customer wanted AppleWatch support for his setup. AppleWatch is available with RA2 (which he clearly seemed unaware of). If he said the customer wanted Homekit - then sure his point of Caseta vs RA2 would be valid, but he said the guy wanted Watch support.

    I get that this has turned into a thread for complaining about Lutron ignoring RA2, but my point was directed right at the guy who said he had a customer that wanted AppleWatch. Don't try and shout me down for being right, just because I'm not joining in the complaining.

  2. #22
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    This thread is on HomeKit, and mark2457 referenced a HomeKit article that talks about technology that doesn't work on RA2 (not yet anyway). To have the broadest functionality he wants (like Siri and HomeKit) on the candidate solutions for AppleWatch, he's stuck with Caseta.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by schalliol View Post
    This thread is on HomeKit, and mark2457 referenced a HomeKit article that talks about technology that doesn't work on RA2 (not yet anyway). To have the broadest functionality he wants (like Siri and HomeKit) on the candidate solutions for AppleWatch, he's stuck with Caseta.
    I see. I wasn't able to see that part where he said he wanted Siri and HomeKit integration. I totally missed the point.

  4. #24
    The question that Lutron has to address is:
    What are the real benefits of deploying RadioRA2 over Caseta?
    Especially since
    1. RadioRA2 costs more and requires "professional installation"
    2. Lacks HomeKit integration
    3. Both Caseta and RadioRA2 utilize ClearConnect

    A nicer selection of switches/ dimmers for RadioRA2 simply isn't enough.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bktay View Post
    The question that Lutron has to address is:
    What are the real benefits of deploying RadioRA2 over Caseta?
    Especially since
    1. RadioRA2 costs more and requires "professional installation"
    2. Lacks HomeKit integration
    3. Both Caseta and RadioRA2 utilize ClearConnect

    A nicer selection of switches/ dimmers for RadioRA2 simply isn't enough.
    (the RA2 keypads are a big difference between the two systems, IMO...)

    #1 you don't have to have a pro install RA2.
    #2 is really the key point, but I'd word this differently, like:

    Q: "Why does the more expensive and more-featured RA2 system lack the modern 3rd party integration of the lower-cost / lower-functionality Caseta system?"

    And the answer I'd like hear is "an upgraded Main Repeater is coming soon" or "a software connection between Smart Bridge Pro and the RA2 Repeater is coming soon". But I'd settle with an answer of "We know, and we're working on it, stay tuned, we're fixing it..."

    Jeff

  6. Likes schalliol liked this post
  7. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Bktay View Post
    The question that Lutron has to address is:
    What are the real benefits of deploying RadioRA2 over Caseta?
    Especially since
    1. RadioRA2 costs more and requires "professional installation"
    2. Lacks HomeKit integration
    3. Both Caseta and RadioRA2 utilize ClearConnect

    A nicer selection of switches/ dimmers for RadioRA2 simply isn't enough.
    Not sure No 2 is accurate. there's an AppleWatch app for Ra2/QS, so I would presume that means Homekit support is/will be available. Lutron can't afford to upset their high-end customers

  8. #27
    1. Even though in practice, you can obtain components online (eBay, ...), perform walk around programming or get access to the RadioRA2 Essentials software..., it does not detract from the facts that
    a. RadioRA2 components are significantly more expensive and
    b. RadioRA2 is intended (according to the official Lutron line) to be installed by professionals who have at least passed the level 1 certification.

    2. The main repeater is not HomeKit compatible like the new Lutron hub for Caseta as it does not contain the necessary ecc (elliptic curve cryptography) chip that is used to encrypt all messages passed on the ethernet interface.

    There are several interesting issues that HomeKit integration brings into the open
    a. Since cloud access is provided by HomeKit, why should people pay for the remote access subscription required by the official Lutron Home Control+ software for smart devices? As it is, Alarm.com subscribers can issue commands to the main repeater without a remote access subscription...

    b. The current versions of the Home Control+ software do not talk to HomeKit (including the Apple Watch version). Instead they use the existing mechanisms that Lutron has had in place for a while now which also works for the Alarm.com integration. Are the existing communication mechanisms potentially less secure since there is no requirement to encrypt every message (to and from the main repeater/ hub for Caseta) using elliptic curve cryptography?
    Hints -
    i. There is a telnet service that has a default login which cannot be disabled,
    ii. PPTP has been the recommended vpn method. It has since been proven to have security vulnerabilities and is no longer promoted by Microsoft which created the protocol in the first place.

    c. When will the ecosystem get revamped so that there is a unified secure means of communicating with the main repeater/ controller in the Lutron world (that will continue to provide at least same level of integration with 3rd party services like Alarm.com and Chamberlain garage door openers)?

  9. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bktay View Post
    1. Even though in practice, you can obtain components online (eBay, ...), perform walk around programming or get access to the RadioRA2 Essentials software..., it does not detract from the facts that
    a. RadioRA2 components are significantly more expensive and
    b. RadioRA2 is intended (according to the official Lutron line) to be installed by professionals who have at least passed the level 1 certification.
    As a homeowner you can take the level 1 certification tests, which give you 'legit' access to the software. Which is exactly what I did, with the full support of Lutron... They have "homeowner" in their registration portal drop-down list for "occupation"...

    Quote Quote
    2. The main repeater is not HomeKit compatible like the new Lutron hub for Caseta as it does not contain the necessary ecc (elliptic curve cryptography) chip that is used to encrypt all messages passed on the ethernet interface.
    Yes, and let's hope they're working on a solution for that...


    Quote Quote
    There are several interesting issues that HomeKit integration brings into the open
    a. Since cloud access is provided by HomeKit, why should people pay for the remote access subscription required by the official Lutron Home Control+ software for smart devices?
    The pay-for-remote-access model is certainly outdated, and I'd expect competitive pressure for such functions will drive them to drop the fee in the near future. Perhaps that coincides with the release of an updated Main Repeater...

  10. #29
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    I'm with Jeff.

    This thread has the second-most number of posts of any thread on the RA2 forum (about 3x of all others and only C•L dimmers seems to have more). Lutron has to know that the market is changing and it's in the company's best interest to increase the functionality of RR2. There seems to be no need to create an incompatible RR3 system since the communication between the repeaters and devices shouldn't need to change to modernize.

    The lutron.com home page pic is pretty compelling:
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Screen Shot 2015-06-16 at 9.31.00 AM.png 
Views:	24 
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ID:	360

    Looking forward to some sort of announcement.

  11. #30
    The communication to and from the repeater over TCP/IP is the only thing that really needs to be fixed (encrypted).

    The clear connect RF communication between the switches, dimmers, shades, ... and the main repeater does not need to be changed.
    It would be great if there were a way to integrate Caseta to RadioRA2 in the process.
    Ultimately, Lutron will need to fix the marketing

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