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Thread: Three gang junction box, caseta on either end with decora rocker in the middle

  1. #1
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    Three gang junction box, caseta on either end with decora rocker in the middle

    Do you guys snap the tabs on the casetas or do you just leave them and install the decora in the middle. I know for three casetas due to space constraints you need to remove the tabs but not sure if there is space if they can be left on?

    Thanks

  2. #2
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    I remove them only if needed to fit the switches to be conservative. (I use only LED lighting which will not need the tabs in most residential installations based on the wattage consumed.)

    -Matt

  3. #3
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    I always follow Lutron's directions to the letter. Anyway, you don't have to derate if using CFL/LED. RR2 and HQS Maestro dimmers don't have tabs. The switches do which is equally baffling. So I almost always remove them.
    LED, Incorporated
    Raleigh, NC 27614

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    Quote Originally Posted by randyc View Post
    I always follow Lutron's directions to the letter. Anyway, you don't have to derate if using CFL/LED. RR2 and HQS Maestro dimmers don't have tabs. The switches do which is equally baffling. So I almost always remove them.
    Hi Randy, that's the thing, the instructions call for derating for a 3 gang junction box if using 3 caseta dimmers, I figure part of this is so they will fit, as in my three gang which has three casetas the only way I could get them to fit was by removing the heatsink fins, but they don't say anything about a three gang with two casetas on either end and a standard Leviton decora in the center position, I figure that should fit without doing anything more than screwing it in.

    All my lights are LED so figure it doesn't matter much anyway but still if I can leave them intact then would prefer it.

    If you read here it states side by side, what I am looking to do is two in one box but not side by side. http://www.lutron.com/en-US/Service-...gDerating.aspx

    Thanks

  5. #5
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    The "Capacity Derating Chart" on that page and the Caseta instructions state that you don't have to derate the dimmer for CFL/LED only installs. So there is nothing gained by leaving the tabs on. Most ceiling fan controls don't have to be derated either.

    Lutron does state that you have to derate dimmers if installed next to another device. RR2/HQS dimmers don't have tabs and you still have to derate them when installed next to another device - even a non-electronic/mechanical switch. It is based on the reduced ability of the dimmer to dissipate heat and the affect of the heat on the adjacent device.

    The other issue I see is service. Trying to get devices out without touching the grounded heat sink is also a challenge. Although, <cough> <cough> I would never do that without turning the power off first.
    LED, Incorporated
    Raleigh, NC 27614

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by randyc View Post
    The "Capacity Derating Chart" on that page and the Caseta instructions state that you don't have to derate the dimmer for CFL/LED only installs. So there is nothing gained by leaving the tabs on. Most ceiling fan controls don't have to be derated either.

    Lutron does state that you have to derate dimmers if installed next to another device. RR2/HQS dimmers don't have tabs and you still have to derate them when installed next to another device - even a non-electronic/mechanical switch. It is based on the reduced ability of the dimmer to dissipate heat and the affect of the heat on the adjacent device.

    The other issue I see is service. Trying to get devices out without touching the grounded heat sink is also a challenge. Although, <cough> <cough> I would never do that without turning the power off first.
    Thanks Randy,

    I think I have one which is next to a toggle that I didn't break the tabs but this is in the box that I am thinking of changing so when I swap it I might do it right.

    Thanks

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by bozack View Post
    Thanks Randy,

    I think I have one which is next to a toggle that I didn't break the tabs but this is in the box that I am thinking of changing so when I swap it I might do it right.

    Thanks
    I'd like to see that documentation.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by randyc View Post
    The "Capacity Derating Chart" on that page and the Caseta instructions state that you don't have to derate the dimmer for CFL/LED only installs. So there is nothing gained by leaving the tabs on. Most ceiling fan controls don't have to be derated either.

    Lutron does state that you have to derate dimmers if installed next to another device. RR2/HQS dimmers don't have tabs and you still have to derate them when installed next to another device - even a non-electronic/mechanical switch. It is based on the reduced ability of the dimmer to dissipate heat and the affect of the heat on the adjacent device.

    The other issue I see is service. Trying to get devices out without touching the grounded heat sink is also a challenge. Although, <cough> <cough> I would never do that without turning the power off first.
    I don't want to be disrespectful but I called Lutron Support. You do not have to break off the tabs on any dimmer if it fits and does not touch the other device like a switch.

  9. #9
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    [QUOTE=3D Design;19511]I don't want to be disrespectful but I called Lutron Support. You do not have to break off the tabs on any dimmer if it fits and does not touch the other device like a switch.[/QUOTE**

    It's all good. I agree, you don't have to break off the tabs if it fits.

    I just spent an hour on the phone with Tech Support and and confirmed, if you install a dimmer or switch next to any other device, you have to derate it. My original point was that there is no advantage to leaving the tabs on because 1- the tabs don't affect the CFL/LED capacity and, 2 - you still have to derate the device for other loads. It also can make servicing a little more challenging.

    He did note the inconstancy in their documentation. They should state that you have to derate the device if you break the tabs off (per rules for LED/INC/MIX). A device with no tabs in a 1-gang would still be derated. They should also state whether derating applies to any adjacent device or if some devices, like mechanical switches, would be exempt.
    LED, Incorporated
    Raleigh, NC 27614

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by 3D Design View Post
    I don't want to be disrespectful but I called Lutron Support. You do not have to break off the tabs on any dimmer if it fits and does not touch the other device like a switch.
    So this is confusing as it seems support is saying two different things, it would be good if they monitored this board and chimed in with the official word. I actually realize I have three dimmers in this configuration currently, one on a kitchen counter that is between an outlet and a toggle switch, and then one in my family room on the end of a 3 gang with two toggles next to it, and then lastly another in my garage with a toggle on either side, I didn't break the tabs as they fit with plenty of room in each case, I guess the only issue would be if someone tried servicing hot.

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