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Thread: IFTTT for Caseta and RA2 Select, but not for RA2?

  1. #11
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    Exactly. The connect bridge is just some application software that if fully capable of talking to IFTTT if Lutron wanted to develop this. It would be a small development effort, actually relatively cheap for Lutron to do something like this. Your tiny-PC example if proof of concept how easy it is. I am just absolutely puzzled why Lutron is screwing their high-end RR2 customers, not implementing the same cloud features that they do for the low-end product line.

  2. #12
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    Someone smarter than me could always develop a third party integration using the IFTTT maker channel similar to what Chowmein made for URC.

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    Someone smarter than me could always develop a third party integration using the IFTTT maker channel similar to what Chowmein made for URC.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by nicholass817 View Post
    Someone smarter than me could always develop a third party integration using the IFTTT maker channel similar to what Chowmein made for URC.
    Hobbyists have figured out how to hack this feature into the system, so it makes me wonder why Lutron is dragging their ***.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by DDBear View Post
    Hobbyists have figured out how to hack this feature into the system, so it makes me wonder why Lutron is dragging their ***.
    Accepted lag via cloud is generally 500ms, and Lutron finds 400ms to be their maximum acceptable lag in cloud applications like Connect and Caseta apps. IFTTT is far slower than that, and may not execute at all. Completely unacceptable in a $20k install, should be unacceptable in a $500 install. It's a case of you get what you pay for, and Lutron doesn't want their name dragged through the mud because of poor design/execution/hardware/ISP service. My connect bridge stopped working because my wife changed ISPs. Why should I yell at Lutron? It's like yelling at Ferrari because I put crap 87 Octane from the local non-branded gas station and now my car runs poorly. Made Spectrum fix the issue they created.
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  6. #15
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    If 400ms is the maximum acceptable latency for Caseta, and IFTTT is far slower than that, why did Lutron enable IFTTT for Caseta ? In general, the sort of things we need to do with IFTTT don't really need to be high latency. Who cares if my lights don't switch to Away mode for half a second after the nest device switches ?

    And, the ISP argument doesn't really wash either. It's a fact of life that customers cannot be expected to be net experts, and so if Lutron choose to sell an internet enabled product they will have to wade through customer queries about failures that turn out to be problems with the customers internet connection.

    I find Lutrons decision not to enable IFTTT for RadioRa a little strange, but it's their right. They have never made claims that they will do so, so we can't really complain that we were sold something other than promised.

    The good news is that because we have a well defined integration protocol we can enable the missing features ourselves. My setup is more or less working now, and I'm busy adding in proper "Works with Nest" nest integration so that I can respond to Away events.

  7. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by SDR-Mike View Post
    Accepted lag via cloud is generally 500ms, and Lutron finds 400ms to be their maximum acceptable lag in cloud applications like Connect and Caseta apps. IFTTT is far slower than that, and may not execute at all. Completely unacceptable in a $20k install, should be unacceptable in a $500 install. It's a case of you get what you pay for, and Lutron doesn't want their name dragged through the mud because of poor design/execution/hardware/ISP service.
    The fallacy here is Lutron instead concedes a large part of the emerging market to crap that DOES implement these features. It's really tragic how much traction junk using z-wave and zigbee are getting, if only because Lutron won't implement a more cohesive plan to appeal with these markets. Meanwhile doing brain-dead things like "rip and replacement" punishment because someone made the mistake of choosing Caseta but wants more.

    Clearly there's silos of control in Lutron and they're not cooperating with each other. It's a shame, really, because the products are genuinely better at being dimmers... just not at listening to the emerging market's desires for broad levels of compatibility and feature parity ACROSS THE ENTIRE LINE OF PRODUCTS.

  8. #17
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    Actually I think it's worse than that. Lutron appear to have gone out of their way to ensure they are not inter-operable. The Caseta Bridge can clearly talk directly to RA2 components, since it works with RA Select. So they COULD have simply released a new One Bridge To Rule Them All, and deprecated the long in the tooth main repeater. At worst, add a telnet client to the One Bridge, so it can at least talk to a RA2 system.

    For what it brings to the party, the Connect Bridge is pretty lousy bang for buck. It adds very little over and above the old Lutron Home+ app. It could, and should do a whole lot more.

    The normal way this plays out is that the ever increasing competition in the low-end eventually makes high-end an impossible sell, and you're left with the low-margin high volume consumer range. Maybe Lutron know the writing is on the wall, and they are putting all their effort into the low-end before their competition overwhelm them. Is RadioRA2 simply being de-prioritized in favour of Caseta and RA Select ? You heard it here first ;-)

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  10. #18
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    It's always been the case that Clear Connect devices, ones using RF, are all using the same technology. And that the repeaters, hubs or other interfaces are deliberately crippled/limited to only speak to certain 'whitelisted' items. Caseta, Ra2 and HWQS are all the same. Lutron's just artificially restricted what speaks to what, and charged more for essentially exactly the same devices. Now, some of the devices themselves DO have greater functionality. Ra2 and HWQ dimmers often have more control options (phase, cut-offs, etc). But there's nothing other than Lutron's management decisions that has ever prevented one from working on the other.

    It's dumb, it's been dumb for nearly a decade, and I'd argue it's done more harm than good. If anything it's given breathing room for crappy low-end entrants and those have won customers than won't be easily swayed toward Lutron. Why? Because Lutron's fractured/silo'd approach to the markets has made them easy targets to be picked upon. Rip-and-replace punishment, gouging for overpriced gear, some features in some apps, not in others. They're all over the place, and that makes it easy for others to take market away from them.

    Sure, the Lutron products ARE better at being electrical devices. But at addressing emerging customer markets? They're tone deaf and apparently unwilling to realize it.

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  12. #19
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    I'm a huge proponent of a One Bridge to Rule Them All approach. Take a page from the AV world and License "expansion packs" to get RadioRA2/HWQS programming functionality and allow the expansion packs to continue to use previous "versions" hardware. Make money on the expanded license instead of the HomeWorks dimmer. Some people (not me) like the Caseta aesthetic (easy to understand) and some prefer Maestro. Now there is Graphic T and Pallodium. Let people have choices, but not hamstring the install with the mentioned "silos". If you want more features, just pay for the appropriate license.
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  14. #20
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    Do you think rivals such as Insteon are going to eat away at the high-end product lineup ? I've not seen the Insteon lineup in the flesh, but one of my friends has it installed and from his description it sounds very similar in terms of features, and is much cheaper ($50 per switch, instead of $140 - and $75 for a keypad, instead of $300!). They even have integration solutions for RJ45, USB, and RS232. I guess Lutron gives a more holistic solution with the shading control, but if a customer only cares about lighting, does RA2 offer enough over Insteon to justify an almost 3x cost differential ?

    Plus, I'm told that Insteon switches/dimmers are actually more versatile than an RA2 device, because they are like cut down, single-button, Hybrid keypads, with a separation between local load and button.

    My prediction about Lutron de-prioritizing RA2 and HWS was tongue in cheek, but if rivals such as Insteon continue to eat into the RA2 features, is it so silly an idea ?

    I love my RA2 smart-home, and I'll continue having fun programming my value-add tiny-pc solution, and work-around the standard RA2 limitations. But I do fear that Lutron have dropped the ball in this regard.

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