PRO vs ELV+ Dimmer (or bad neutral?)

[geosfz]

Have track lighting trying to control. Each bulb has its' own transformer, and are MR16 (GU5.3) bulbs. 12V DC, IIRC. So I presume it is MLV.


Initially tried the basic switch (PD-6WCL?), but it did not like LED bulbs. (Last I checked there were no "approved" LED lights in the MR16/DC style.)

From a suggestion here, I got the ELV+ Dimmer (PD-5NE) as it has a neutral and should work better with LED lights. There was a capped bundle of white wires behind the switches that were not used by the previous switches, so the neutral got connected to that.

Problem is when the breaker was turned back on, all the lights (3 total) on the track would only blink on briefly about every 4 seconds. Just blink. At the switch dimming did not work, although I think OFF at least stopped the lights from blinking.

Tried setting trim. No effect.

Tried to confirm the ELV/MLV status of the switch by pulling the FASS. Briefly pulling/pushing it couldn't get into setting mode. Pulling and waiting a few seconds, would eventually cause the top and middle indicator lights on the switch to blink. Lights in fixtures would fail to ON and switch wouldn't do anything, DIM or OFF. Still couldn't enter the ELV/MLV setting mode.

According to the documentation for advanced setup (p. 73) that blinking means "Product detected an MlV fault (PRO Dimmer only)". It states Pro only, so the ELV+ shouldn't produce and error like that?? Or is the documentation in error??

But this got me looking at the Pro version.

• Does the Pro version handle MLV better?
• Should I switch to that one instead?


Also, I didn't think to test the neutrals, as I presumed if they were run, then they were connected. I instead got distracted by the possibility of the Pro being a better solution, and just put the old switch back for the time as I was loosing daylight.

• Could the neutrals just not be connected? Is that a common thing?

If so, neither the Pro nor the ELV+ would work properly, but as I said, the documentation got me thinking I needed a different switch. I can pull the whole thing apart another day, but wanted get opinions/information on if the Pro is better suited for the kinds of lights I have.

[randyc]

First, verify if the driver is MLV or ELV. Check the model number at the manufacturers website. A rule of thumb is that magnetic transformers will feel heavy for their size (they are a magnet encased in varnish), electronic transformers will feel light (they are circuit boards) and will be very small. Some ELV can be thumb size.

Second, verify if the driver/transformer AND LED are dimmable.

The dimmer may be having problems detecting the load type. You could hook it up to an incandescent load and set it to the proper load type. You still may have a compatibility issue. The blinking lights are probably a sign of incompatibility.

The neutrals have to be connected or you would not have a complete circuit and the light would not work.

The PRO dimmer does not do reverse phase/trailing edge/ELV dimming. If you have ELV the PRO dimmer would not have to try and determine the load type.

[geosfz]

Thanks for your reply. Lots of good points in there.

1. I'm guessing that the driver is MLV from a) the "error code" on the ELV+ and b) what little I've read following that up. They are slightly base heavy, so I think MLV is correct. But I'll pull out the ladder tomorrow and try to check with manufacturer.

2. The bulbs claim to be. (Even bought "better" bulbs to test.) And the transformer should be. They do work with the halogen style bulbs and the PD-6WCL.

3. Not sure how to "hook it up to an incandescent load", beyond using the aforementioned halogen bulb.

4. Neutrals. Well, the PD-6WCL doesn't use any and it works for non-LED bulbs. The ELV+ Dimmer didn't like any kind of bulb. But it is really weird the error code doesn't happen until I pull the FASS. It can turn "off" the lights (i.e., stop providing power so the blinking ceases), but it just doesn't power them beyond blinks.

5. Thanks for the info on the PRO not having reverse phase. Good point. So, If A) I can confirm the transformer is indeed MLV, and B) The ELV+ is having trouble in auto-detection and perhaps getting stuck, the Pro just side steps the problem by going straight MLV.



I think I can get everything working with the old-style bulbs and the PD-6WCL. But for obvious reasons of power consumption and HEAT, I'd really rather have the LEDs working. (Although with summer gone, I'm not going to complain about the heat for a while.)

[SDR-Mike]

geosfz-

If the transformer is attached to each track fixture, my experience is that they will be ELV. Usually see a MLV when the transformer is remotely powering the track lighting. Get a picture or a part number and post it up.

That being said- tons of people claim to have a good or great dimming MR16. Go Green Creative. Save the Tylenol. All the others will give you troubles at some point.

AFAIW the ELV dimmer must be manually changed from ELV to MLV. It does not auto switch between as the RadioRA2 6NA does. And either way, the neutral will vastly improve performance.