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Thread: Smart Toggle Switch Options without Neutral Wire

  1. #1
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2023

    Smart Toggle Switch Options without Neutral Wire

    So the DVRF-5NS-WH-R claro smart switch sadly requires a neutral wire. I'm looking for that same functionality and look without requiring a neutral wire. For example, the DVRF-6L-WH-R diva smart dimmer fits these requirements with the added capability of dimming. However, I have a unique situation: the switch I am trying to put this in for is fed by a diva smart dimmer. By that I mean the power for this switch comes from the diva smart dimmer. If the diva is turned off, this switch has no power and turns off. So, given that a diva functions without a neutral, I attempted installing it in this situation (so I have a diva feeding a diva). Everything functions as expected, except one issue - the lights on the second diva have a significantly reduced maximum brightness, probably about 20% dimmer than normal. Somehow, even with both diva's at their max brightness setting, the second diva's lights are being dimmed. I figured a smart dimmer feeding a smart dimmer wouldn't play nice, so I'm not surprised. Unfortunately, I've decided I can't live with this. So I'm looking essentially for the same functionality as a diva without the dimmer. Any ideas?

    If there is no good answer, I will likely install a dumb paddle switch, like the CA-1PS-WH. This is likely the best answer, but I'm holding out in case someone has a better one. The downside to this is I'm not a fan of the permanent on/off state of regular switches - I like how digital/smart switches return to the neutral position after pressing. Also ideally I can have the smart functionality for this switch (even though it obviously wouldn't be available when the switch that's feeding it is off), but I can live without it in this specific situation.

    Also, bonus points if someone can tell me the general term for a switch being powered by another switch (like how 3-way switch describes two switches working together, but that's a different situation). I couldn't even figure out how to google this since I can't describe it well enough haha.

  2. #2
    Lutron Technical Support
    Join Date
    Jan 2022

    I wanted to confirm something in the first paragraph you posted. That there is a dimmer powering another dimmer. Both dimmers are controlling their own independent lighting loads, correct? If so, then toggling one dimmer on/off should not affect the performance of the other unless we are jumping power from the switched hot of the first dimmer to the hot of the second dimmer. Thereby toggling the first dimmer off would interrupt power to the second dimmer. If this is the case, make sure that the jumper wire that connects the second dimmer to power is connected to the hot of the first dimmer and not the switched hot. This will prevent the first dimmer from interrupting power to the second.

    Currently there are only 2 paddle style Caséta devices: the DVRF-5NS (neutral required on/off switch) and the DVRF-6L (non-neutral dimmer). You are correct that the CA-1PS-WH would be the alternative to a DVRF-5NS if you need an on/off switch without a neutral that is a paddle style. The only Caséta on/off switch that currently does not have a neutral connection is the PD-5WS-DV however this switch is in the "original" Caséta style.

    In tech support we typically refer to that scenario as jumping power from one switch to the next.

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