Caseta Pro Switches

[wkearney99]

Seems strange the the shades are compatible with Caseta (proBridge) and RR2, but switches are not. Will stop a lot of people upgrading

It seems that's been Lutron's plan from the start. Rip-and-replace. Tear out the Caseta stuff, throw it away, and buy all new RA2 or QS gear. There's just so many ways that's a bad plan, but made even worse based on the underlying technology in the devices being EXACTLY the same. It's only the firmware in the hubs/repeaters and the setup software that prevents one line from being used with the other. It seems this was deemed acceptable in order to preserve their notion of protected reseller channels (and likely profit margins). Seems like a pretty bad plan, but they do seem committed to it.

So yes, a customer that really likes Lutron gear and was willing to buy into a lot of it, will be forced to throw all that away if they want to buy more Lutron gear to fit their needs.

[timchaas]

Seems strange the the shades are compatible with Casete (proBridge) and RR2, but switches are not. Will stop a lot of people upgrading

That's my current biggest complaint against Lutron is there are too many stovepipe product family's; Maestro Wireless, Caseta, RR2, HW.....

I've had a number of occasions where we start a person with one product because its the right price and product for that application and then they fall in love with the solution and want to do more and then "oh boy..". I have to tell them we can't do that without swapping the dimmers or the processor or the... You can't start a user with RR2 if they don't have the budget.

They need a single processor with universal and compatible dimmers and switches and then software option the processor for MIs or Keypads or Garage Interfaces, etc.

That would be hugely popular with integrators (like myself) and Lutron could carry so many fewer products and we could scale from a single dimmer to a full house. It would be glorious!

This is why the Control4 and z-wave systems are starting to gain ground. Simplicity.

Rant over.

[asherrick]

That's my current biggest complaint against Lutron is there are too many stovepipe product family's; Maestro Wireless, Caseta, RR2, HW.....

They need a single processor with universal and compatible dimmers and switches and then software option the processor for MIs or Keypads or Garage Interfaces, etc.

That would be hugely popular with integrators (like myself) and Lutron could carry so many fewer products and we could scale from a single dimmer to a full house. It would be glorious!

Preach it! It's nice to hear this kind of thinking coming from an integrator.

[wkearney99]

This is why the Control4 and z-wave systems are starting to gain ground. Simplicity.

Yes, simplicity in SKUs and device upgrade paths would absolutely be a great choice for integrator. But it'd also bring about a great amount of versatility and THAT is what other vendors are offering. The other devices might be crap (dimmer-wise) but the customers see their out-of-the-box versatility as being more useful to them.

Heh, the C4 crowd makes the point that the RA2 switches are LESS expensive. But worth the added price because of more versatility in how the buttons can be used.

[malba2366]

It seems that's been Lutron's plan from the start. Rip-and-replace. Tear out the Caseta stuff, throw it away, and buy all new RA2 or QS gear. There's just so many ways that's a bad plan, but made even worse based on the underlying technology in the devices being EXACTLY the same. It's only the firmware in the hubs/repeaters and the setup software that prevents one line from being used with the other. It seems this was deemed acceptable in order to preserve their notion of protected reseller channels (and likely profit margins). Seems like a pretty bad plan, but they do seem committed to it.

So yes, a customer that really likes Lutron gear and was willing to buy into a lot of it, will be forced to throw all that away if they want to buy more Lutron gear to fit their needs.

I think this will change as the home automation space moves forward. The programming is now so easy with a smart phone that you do not need custom installers/integrators for all but the most complicated homes. Companies such as nest/Google, and Apple will force the traditional players hand and force them to cater more to the end customer than to the installer. One proof of this starting to happen is that Savant is releasing a user programmable remote early next year...just a couple years ago you would have thought hell would freeze over before that ever happened!

[wkearney99]

Simple stuff is definitely within the scope of DIY. Simple stuff across an entire house is likewise easy enough. But when you start to get into scenes and conditionals it's a bit harder than most folks realize. There's absolutely a place for integrators to handle this kind of stuff. When you do it for a living you certainly learn a lot of right and wrong ways to approach automation.

I really think it's unfortunate that Lutron implemented Caseta they way they did. Leaving no sane upgrade path pretty much freezes out a customer that's invested in Lutron gear from any kind of quality upgrade path.

Yes, there'd always be the chance of someone 'cheaping' out and doing something dastardly like buying inexpensive Caseta switches instead of pricier RA2 or QS gear. Right, heaven forbid they weren't willing to bend over for the profit margin of RA2 and QS gear.

So, let's teach them a lesson! Make them throw out all that gear and start over entirely from scratch! That'll teach 'em! Right... to go with a vendor that doesn't have such a moronic set of plans.

As a RA2 advocate I'm depressed to see such things. Especially when it's not the underlying technology that's defective here. It's the corporate policies and deliberate blacklisting of devices. Meanwhile, z-wave and zigbee gear from other vendors is flying out the doors.

[veeeh]

As a RA2 advocate I'm depressed to see such things. Especially when it's not the underlying technology that's defective here. It's the corporate policies and deliberate blacklisting of devices. Meanwhile, z-wave and zigbee gear from other vendors is flying out the doors.

I think people looking at Caseta would compare it primarily with Insteon ... and if they need more than 50 devices, comparison will end here - even if Insteon is not as robust as Caseta or RA2.

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/162-ho...-question.html

[asherrick]

I think people looking at Caseta would compare it primarily with Insteon ... and if they need more than 50 devices, comparison will end here - even if Insteon is not as robust as Caseta or RA2.

Insteon does so much more than Caseta, and even RA. It's a whole-house automation system, not just lighting control. It doesn't seem like they really have any competition anywhere near their price point. You would need to step up to something like Control4 or Crestron to better their total offering.

I looked hard at Insteon before committing to Caseta. I was only interested in lighting control and felt like Caseta was a more solid lighting product, though certainly more limited and less flexible. Since Caseta integrates with the big whole-house control systems I figured that I would always layer that on top of Caseta if I wanted to go that route. Time will tell whether I made the right decision...

[wkearney99]

Insteon, like a lot of home automation protocols, looks great on paper. In the real world, however, it's not been without it's pitfalls. Z-wave, zigbee, Insteon, etc, all have their adventures. When it comes to lighting performance it's hard to beat Lutron. But on many other fronts there are some very viable solutions. It's on those fronts that Lutron really seem to have dropped the ball.

[SDR-Mike]

Insteon, like a lot of home automation protocols, looks great on paper. In the real world, however, it's not been without it's pitfalls. Z-wave, zigbee, Insteon, etc, all have their adventures. When it comes to lighting performance it's hard to beat Lutron. But on many other fronts there are some very viable solutions. It's on those fronts that Lutron really seem to have dropped the ball.

Having worked as a Lutron rep focused on Ra2 and Caseta, I "drank the kool-aid". Lutron has a philosophy that if someone else is doing it well, there's no need to try and re-invent a wheel that works well. Take in-wall sensors for example- most are okay at best. The XCT technology Lutron developed works very well. So Lutron built a better mousetrap. But if the mousetrap already works well, then why? Better to focus on their core business- lighting control- and play well with the others.