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Thread: 0-10V using LMJ-5T-DV-B

  1. #1
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    0-10V using LMJ-5T-DV-B

    We are trying to use RA2 to remotely control an Infratech heater controller that ramps heater output according to a 0-10VDC input signal.
    see attached diagram of heater controller.

    A RA2 compatible device might be the LMJ-5T-DV-B, but I don't see the LMJ-5t-DV-B under RF modules in RA2 Inclusive 8.0 software. And how do you control its 0-10V output? Only with a pico, or can you us an RRD-6D or RR-VCRX or exclusively through Lutron Homecontrol+ app?

    See similar posts controlling Infratech with Homeworks: https://forums.lutron.com/showthread...ater-with-TVMs
    Similar to the post above, We could install RR-8ANS switches to remotely control relays connected to supply-power to the heaters, to turn them off completely, if the lowest trim of the 0-10V device is not low enough to completely turn off the heaters.

    Other forums mention using RA2 compatible an RRD-10ND and the GRX-TVI.
    https://forums.lutron.com/showthread...-10V-RF-Dimmer

    But this provides 16A for ballast, whereas I just need the 0-10v because the heaters are powered by a built-to-order heater controller. See attached diagram.
    Attached Files Attached Files

  2. #2
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    We've done lots of these in San Diego, that's the right part if you have inclusive. The relay modules should be right next to the WPM, you'll have to use a pull down menu when you add to the design- same splash screen where you name the "dimmer". It should have a pull down menu exactly like the the dimmer pull down menu to select between the 16R, CCO, and 5T models.

    Side note- The infratech controller does NOT have a 0-10V power source. The LMJ-5T-DV-B does supply the power for the dimming signal. Essentials users would need a neutral dimmer (10ND) and a custom GRX-TVI (GRX-TVI CPN 3876, I believe) to get the power supply. That custom GRX-TVI doubles the cost and has about a 6 week lead time to make the part.
    Last edited by SDR-Mike; 07-27-2015 at 11:20 AM. Reason: added info for Essentials users
    Business Development Associate for Baker Electric Solar

    mbalay@bakerelectricsolar.com

    "Spread the light, brother" -​Blake Richetta

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by SanDiegoRep View Post
    We've done lots of these in San Diego, that's the right part if you have inclusive. The relay modules should be right next to the WPM, you'll have to use a pull down menu when you add to the design- same splash screen where you name the "dimmer". It should have a pull down menu exactly like the the dimmer pull down menu to select between the 16R, CCO, and 5T models.

    Side note- The infratech controller does NOT have a 0-10V power source. The LMJ-5T-DV-B does supply the power for the dimming signal. Essentials users would need a neutral dimmer (10ND) and a custom GRX-TVI (GRX-TVI CPN 3876, I believe) to get the power supply. That custom GRX-TVI doubles the cost and has about a 6 week lead time to make the part.

    Thanks for your help. Found the pull-down menu to the LMJ-5T-DV-B where you said it was.
    Since you've done these Infratechs, it appears that the LMJ-5T-DV-B can be assigned to a pico or a keypad button press, but cannot be assigned to a dimmer directly. So the LMJ-5T-DV-B controls on or off only in Inclusive programming. You can't dim the 0-10V out of LMJ-5T-DV-B to send a signal to the heater controller for low, medium, or high? Maybe Infratech heater controllers don't have low-high, just on or off? I tried changing a raise/lower button type on a pico or table top keypad to "raise programmed devices" but still can't affect the LMJ-5T-DV-B, which only responds on/off to buttons, not raise/lower. Also, making sure heater is completely off.... There's a forum discussion I referenced that mentions that the low on the 0-10V when off might not be trimmed low enough to completely turn off heaters, so an RPM4U is recommended. What about a an 8ANS to a relay to the power supply of the heater to completely turn them off, regardless of the level of the LMJ-5T-DV-B?

  4. #4
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    The LMJ-5T-DV-B has a 5A switch built in, in addition to the 0-10v control. You should be able to assign a Pico to control it, or a keypad button. The LMJ-5T is considered a dimmer by the software. Try running the 5T switch leg portion to a 120V coil 2 pole contactor. When the LMJ is "off", the coil should open andd behave as a hard switch for the 240V heaters. It will require a pull can, but you should be able to power the LMJ from the heater circuit ahead of the heater, then come back to the contactor (after the LMJ) to get your off for the heaters. Someone from Lutron might chime in on this, but it's worked before. The Infratech tech support wasn't really up to speed with 0-10v controls when I spoke to the engineer about a year ago.
    Business Development Associate for Baker Electric Solar

    mbalay@bakerelectricsolar.com

    "Spread the light, brother" -​Blake Richetta

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  6. #5
    I have done this several times with QS, I am now doing one with RA2 and am learning it here. I intend to use a small 12 volt relay that will drop out at 3 volts to go full off on heaters. I still have to design the dimming aspect, that is a must. Please share your findings and I will also share mine. Thanks. When using the TVI, I had to use osram OTDIM modules to creat the 0-10V.

  7. #6
    We also do this all the time, before the 5T module we even built custom circuits to convert adaptive Dimmer to 0-10v. Now that this module is available, it's even better. We build a control panel, use a RR2 keypad for local control and typically have a fail-safe "heater off" timer(schedule) at 2 or 3 am, so no one leaves them all on night. I would recommend using a different SSR though than the typical one from Infratech or ask them to provide or quote their phase angle controller instead of their standard burst fire, especially when you are controlling close to 10kw of heaters or more. We have seen this cause adverse effects in certain (not all) projects, effecting other circuits or lights in the house when the heaters come on, causing some strobing or surging in other electrical circuits. The phase angle reduces or eliminates this. It costs a little more initially, but if you don't request it and run into this problem you get to basically buy a new control panel and/or rebuild the initial panel.

    Likewise, if RR2 is not necessary the RMJ-5T version will work with PICO. Or if you would just like something cleaner than their knob control, and you can wire from control location to the control panel, you can use a Diva, Nova or other 0-10v dimmer

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  9. #7
    Reviving an old thread. I have a new outdoor Haiku fan/light on my patio. Haiku outdoor fans aren't wifi enabled, so the only option they offer for controlling them from an external system is 0-10v control. They have a dual channel 0-10v module that disables the handheld remote capability and allows for fan speed and light dimming via separate 0-10v inputs. They have indicated that their 0-10v module works with Diva 0-10v dimmers.

    Has anyone ever worked with these fans using 0-10v, and if so did you use the LMJ-5T-DV-B? (Requires Inclusive, I know.)

    Thanks!

  10. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by gt3mike View Post
    Reviving an old thread. I have a new outdoor Haiku fan/light on my patio. Haiku outdoor fans aren't wifi enabled, so the only option they offer for controlling them from an external system is 0-10v control. They have a dual channel 0-10v module that disables the handheld remote capability and allows for fan speed and light dimming via separate 0-10v inputs. They have indicated that their 0-10v module works with Diva 0-10v dimmers.

    Has anyone ever worked with these fans using 0-10v, and if so did you use the LMJ-5T-DV-B? (Requires Inclusive, I know.)

    Thanks!
    Sorry to be useless, haven't done this one exactly. I have done several other things with them, motor speed control & electric heater controls, etc... If the Diva works, this should work just fine. You should know if it "sinks" or "sources" the 0-10v. In the case of the Diva it only sinks, so we can derive the fan uses a sink type dimmer. I'm only stating this for other readers to clarify. For the LMJ-5T, it really doesn't matter, it can do either.

  11. #9
    Great. I think the only hitch could be if the module doesn’t go all the way to 0v. The fan/light only has one 120v power lead, and it will need to be always on if I want to be able to use fan or light independently

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by gt3mike View Post
    Great. I think the only hitch could be if the module doesn’t go all the way to 0v. The fan/light only has one 120v power lead, and it will need to be always on if I want to be able to use fan or light independently
    Yes, this could be tricky. I would need to see the schematic to fully understand and recommend. I think they will go to 0v from our testing, but I would guarantee it.
    If using 2 controllers (1each for fan and 1 for Light). You could use 1 of the LMJ's as the switched power, but that would only be helpful if say you were only going to use the light while the fan was on or the opposite.

    Alternately you could use a RR2 switch only(RRD-8ANS) separately for main power, disregard the switch leg(s) on the LMJ's and by programming the keypads/pico properly it would be function seamlessly. This would give you a positive off, and any on delay should be negligible. Also, depending on how it is currently wired, you may be able to use the switch in it's intended location in the room if there is one. If you use the same switch to power the LMJ's it should come on to it's last setting I believe... I prefer the Keypad or Pico Method as you would have more direction & control of whats happening.

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